Let's talk about the sound system at the Turmbühne & Tanzwüste: solution to bring Funktion One back

[xrtze]

I also want to add that the LL system would be capable of delivering the bass you are looking for IF the PA crew could crank it up. But they can't do it for various reasons. It would be interesting to hear a full on LL system in the wild without regulations.

I heard that (or something near) twice during soundcheck thid year and 2021 - rest assured that the system is capable of digging up the floor. the chief engineer from audiofeel berlin is hinself an audiophile and enthusiadt and very capable.

I would like to add, that the number of people on the floor as well as temerature and Air humidity can influence the reach of different parts of the frequency band quite dramatically. with respect to this years weather conditions, i guess sound engineers had to do quite a lot of in vivo readjustments.
At another festival where I helped building a floor, the soundcrew had lots of time for soundchecking. Sound was already amazing on their LL-System, but the bass was not perfect. Once they through in a certain preset from another crew, it went from nice to stunning perfection. Only afterwards, we would realize how much of a differnence it did. It was a monocluster, so my point here is that on a complex constellation like Turmbühne they might just need time and feel to develop the right tuning, because the 52x for sure can outplay the 2016 setup in terms of SPL (and even clarity).

Still, i am with OP, but not so much regarding bass levels/feels but more the general sound impression/mids. Soundwise, both Tanzwüste and Turmbühne were the reference setup in 2016 (with Tanzwüste on prime position). This might be a matter of taste, as described in the other thread about Tanzwüste soundsystem. There is something about the F1 mids i love (and others find boring) that make them very direct and tactile, neither db nor lacoustics line arrays usually Provide. Lambda Labs can sound equally nice, but cleaner and less frontal. Most times in the ladt years, when i approached a floor and only by listening thought "Wow wow wow!", it was a well tuned F1. Then again, earlier this year i literally started crying in front of a LL TX3+DH18 combination because it sounded so incredibly immersive.

[Guise]

I also want to add that the LL system would be capable of delivering the bass you are looking for IF the PA crew could crank it up. But they can't do it for various reasons. It would be interesting to hear a full on LL system in the wild without regulations.

"I would like to add, that the number of people on the floor...."

I think this is a very underrated aspect, though not sure how big the impact in reality is. For me, it felt like the stages Turmbühne, Tanzwüste and Sonnendeck were really crowded this year (at least when I was at them). For example, Sonnendeck PA, unfortunately didnt sound well when the floor was packed. I tried out several positions but even near the center it did not sound well. The highs were gone and the mids / bass sounded muddy. It did sound well (though still not mindblowing) when it wasnt super crowded anymore and when you were closer to the stage. I assume, the sound engineers setup the PA for a specific maximum amount of people.

While we could say this is "whining at a high level", I think the "sound aspect" leads to another, for me most annoying aspect of this year Fusion:
People were walking around the dancefloor all the time. Whereever I stood and danced, there were groups of people passing from all directions constantly. And, I cant really blame them, they were probably looking for the sound the OP described, but they did not know they cant find it anywhere with the actual amount of people.

Idea (While not knowing if its possible):
- Consider much more reserves when setting up the PA, so that really packed floors still sound well
- Limit people per floors / stages (at least where its possible)

Benefit:
- Better sound for all
- Less push and shove on the dancefloor because more sweet spots in sound

[elllo]

(…)

Thanks for raising the awareness of hearing damage and hearing protection! Very useful information! Thanks!

Hi What about love,

Thank you, that's very kind of you and happy to make my contribution for a better Fusion:)

Big thanks from my side too for raising awareness. Probably too late for parts of my hearing but better late than never. I have some concert ear plugs, which I never wear, because they make the sound muddy. Can you recommend specific ones?

[RichardG]

I also want to add that the LL system would be capable of delivering the bass you are looking for IF the PA crew could crank it up. But they can't do it for various reasons. It would be interesting to hear a full on LL system in the wild without regulations.

Let me add my 50 cents: I`m a Vienna based sound technician and work with various systems in different locations. When I have the choice to choose a hornloaded PA I`d always opt for a QX system over any other option. The clarity is astonishing. Walk back, move around it is homogeneous. The Resulution speakers from Funktion differ a bit depending on type, but all of them lack in throw and are comb filtering like crazy.
Transient response is a must have for electronic music. The Lambda Labs DH-18 with a full long horn are way superior than the any mono-tone bandpass construction like a F221.

And this is why I also have to write. One part is the system. The other the technician, the input quality and regulations. I have to commit to you flameijer. As guest concentrated on party I don`t mind that much. As sound guy I had the same feeling. It felt like the sub array haven`t been perfectly aligned with the L/R rig. The DH-18 produces a super tight response. The bass at Turmbühne was not tight enough for my feeling.

The LL system is a great choice, way ahead of other options. But I definitely heared better setups with QX in the past. Please invest more time in the alignment and consider people too who are standing outside the sweetspot. In the right spot I was overwhelmed and cried tears of joy!

[flameijer]

Thanks for raising the awareness of hearing damage and hearing protection! Very useful information! Thanks!

Hi What about love,

Thank you, that's very kind of you and happy to make my contribution for a better Fusion:)

Big thanks from my side too for raising awareness. Probably too late for parts of my hearing but better late than never. I have some concert ear plugs, which I never wear, because they make the sound muddy. Can you recommend specific ones?

Thanks elllo, it's my pleasure. I would recommend to just go to your local hearing care professional/audiologist. I bought my first custom earplugs at 'beterhoren' store in the Netherlands and my second at pluggerz.com. But I'm not aware of similar parties in Germany but Google can help:)

[flameijer]

I also want to add that the LL system would be capable of delivering the bass you are looking for IF the PA crew could crank it up. But they can't do it for various reasons. It would be interesting to hear a full on LL system in the wild without regulations.

"I would like to add, that the number of people on the floor...."

I think this is a very underrated aspect, though not sure how big the impact in reality is. For me, it felt like the stages Turmbühne, Tanzwüste and Sonnendeck were really crowded this year (at least when I was at them). For example, Sonnendeck PA, unfortunately didnt sound well when the floor was packed. I tried out several positions but even near the center it did not sound well. The highs were gone and the mids / bass sounded muddy. It did sound well (though still not mindblowing) when it wasnt super crowded anymore and when you were closer to the stage. I assume, the sound engineers setup the PA for a specific maximum amount of people.

While we could say this is "whining at a high level", I think the "sound aspect" leads to another, for me most annoying aspect of this year Fusion:
People were walking around the dancefloor all the time. Whereever I stood and danced, there were groups of people passing from all directions constantly. And, I cant really blame them, they were probably looking for the sound the OP described, but they did not know they cant find it anywhere with the actual amount of people.

Idea (While not knowing if its possible):
- Consider much more reserves when setting up the PA, so that really packed floors still sound well
- Limit people per floors / stages (at least where its possible)

Benefit:
- Better sound for all
- Less push and shove on the dancefloor because more sweet spots in sound

Very good point indeed Guise regarding the people moving around the dance floor. I was one of them
Bigger sweet spots solves this ' problem'.

[flameijer]

I also want to add that the LL system would be capable of delivering the bass you are looking for IF the PA crew could crank it up. But they can't do it for various reasons. It would be interesting to hear a full on LL system in the wild without regulations.

Let me add my 50 cents: I`m a Vienna based sound technician and work with various systems in different locations. When I have the choice to choose a hornloaded PA I`d always opt for a QX system over any other option. The clarity is astonishing. Walk back, move around it is homogeneous. The Resulution speakers from Funktion differ a bit depending on type, but all of them lack in throw and are comb filtering like crazy.
Transient response is a must have for electronic music. The Lambda Labs DH-18 with a full long horn are way superior than the any mono-tone bandpass construction like a F221.

And this is why I also have to write. One part is the system. The other the technician, the input quality and regulations. I have to commit to you flameijer. As guest concentrated on party I don`t mind that much. As sound guy I had the same feeling. It felt like the sub array haven`t been perfectly aligned with the L/R rig. The DH-18 produces a super tight response. The bass at Turmbühne was not tight enough for my feeling.

The LL system is a great choice, way ahead of other options. But I definitely heared better setups with QX in the past. Please invest more time in the alignment and consider people too who are standing outside the sweetspot. In the right spot I was overwhelmed and cried tears of joy!

Hi Richard, thank you for your valuable input as a sound technician, really helpful and I would love to learn more about this matter. I have one question: what do you refer to when you're talking about QX?

[elllo]

Hi What about love,

Thank you, that's very kind of you and happy to make my contribution for a better Fusion:)

Big thanks from my side too for raising awareness. Probably too late for parts of my hearing but better late than never. I have some concert ear plugs, which I never wear, because they make the sound muddy. Can you recommend specific ones?

Thanks elllo, it's my pleasure. I would recommend to just go to your local hearing care professional/audiologist. I bought my first custom earplugs at 'beterhoren' store in the Netherlands and my second at pluggerz.com. But I'm not aware of similar parties in Germany but Google can help:)

Thanks! Will definitely check that out. And what are these 2€ plugs from the vending machine in the Clubs good for?

[flameijer]

Big thanks from my side too for raising awareness. Probably too late for parts of my hearing but better late than never. I have some concert ear plugs, which I never wear, because they make the sound muddy. Can you recommend specific ones?

Thanks elllo, it's my pleasure. I would recommend to just go to your local hearing care professional/audiologist. I bought my first custom earplugs at 'beterhoren' store in the Netherlands and my second at pluggerz.com. But I'm not aware of similar parties in Germany but Google can help:)

Thanks! Will definitely check that out. And what are these 2€ plugs from the vending machine in the Clubs good for?

That kind of filter earplugs from the vendor machine muffle around 20 dB, but depends on the brand and the vendor of course:)

PS: If you don't want to spend a lot of money on custom earplugs, simply purchase the Alpine Partyplugs 19dB filter earplugs. They are perfect.

[flameijer]

I also want to add that the LL system would be capable of delivering the bass you are looking for IF the PA crew could crank it up. But they can't do it for various reasons. It would be interesting to hear a full on LL system in the wild without regulations.

Dear people,

I'd like to thank you for responding to my letter and providing useful comments and arguments. After rereading all of the responses, I believe I can draw the following conclusion: prior to government and police intervention (following the 2018 edition), there were almost none or less strict sound regulations, thus the Funktion One system could completely blow-up the dance floor and deliver the infamous and hypnotizing ground shaking bass. However, in order to win the battle with local governments and police over the police station on the venue, Kulturkosmos had to comply to stricter sound regulations. As a result, they began to experiment with different sound setups and systems. Of course, this is all speculation, and I'm still very curious for Kulturkosmos' official statement on the subject.