GSM/3G network in Lärz

[Knülli]

I know. But that's BS IMHO. Senior citizens use iPhones & Co. exactly like us younger peepz. The big displays are even beneficial, so there are plenty of touchscreen phones especially for the elderly (or generally people with impaired vision).

Yes. But that was not the topic of the thread and the reason for mentioning the word pensioneers phone. We only used this word to show about which technological tool we speak and what our technological preferences are: Some people use phones that are calles "pensioneers phone" in phone-shops, because they enjoy the missing smart options in these phones.

[Raetselspass]

I understand. But the better term for what you are describing would be "feature phone" or "dumbphone", because the alleged "pensioner's/senior phone" is not what you think it is.

What you want is a dumbphone that is capable of using RCS, because MMS is gone (for good). And it should support 4G because 2G is about to go away as well.

[irrelevant]

Thanks both for clarifying this -- but OMFG?! The level of frustration. So now you HAVE to use a smartphone to communicate decently, and even to send a simple picture?? That's just insane. Fuck that (even more). Pardon the French.

Why?! MMS never picked up in Germany because they were always very expensive and never included in any subscription plans. 39 ct for up to 300 KB. THAT'S insane. I don't know a single person that willingly sent an MMS, all I ever received were sent by mistake. Switzerland also shutdown MMS years ago.

I'm sorry, but technology is progressing. You just can't sustain all services for all time. Nobody is coming to Fusion by horse carriage, neither.

And what do you mean by "pensioner's phone"? Most older people were still significantly younger when touchscreen phones emerged and are using them like anyone else. You probably mean a feature phone aka dumbphone. I even had Skype on my old Nokia N79.

Speaking for today, all dumbphones that support messenger apps (especially Signal) are Android based and just smartphones with buttons. But it seems like feature phones start supporting RCS as well, so that's probably the route you should take:

https://www.reddit.com/r/dumbphones/com ... _with_rcs/

Well, where I live, go and have stayed it historically has been very different, which might explain my stance on MMS. F ex here, for a long time it was 100 % included in most plans, that I know. What you state is the 1st time I ever hear.

And another thing: So called "progress" isn't per definition, or always, for the better. Horse carriages f ex don't pollute the way cars do, w/ all those consequences, nor do they use gasoline (probably don't need to get into the negatives of that extraction and use, do I?)

"Pensioner's phone" as in what Knülli says below, but also as mostly only them using dumbphones these days,

And yeah I had internet, incl FB, and more on my Sony Ericsson C905 model, that I used since 2008. Beside the point.

I've kinda understood that -- which is why I opted for one w/o those "services". I'll look into the link though, thanks! Always a plus to be correctly informed.

And for anyone possibly wondering why I am so dead set against smartphones, not just seeing me a hopelessly backwards donkey:

1) Hate touch screens. They are "dead"; non-tactile. Also impossibly difficult to type on for me. Triggers anxiety.

2) They're too large for my hands, too heavy, and highly unsuitable lifestyle-wise. Like paddles. Unpractical, and augments the risk for dropping them (see 3).

3) The most often exorbitant cost. I'm on a very limited budget w/ little possibility of changing that.

4) How much more fragile they are, than dumbphones, generally speaking. Added expenses (not exactly cheap to fix either); added problems.

5) Having to update them periodically, like a computer, eventually having them rendered obsolete so that you are forced to get a new one even if your current specimen otherwise is fine.

6) Smartphones overall are so brimming full of shite, I seriously would risk a psychosis. What's in there, what do I want to keep, where (in which order and so on), what are the settings of everything and their mother, ooh -- there are 20 other apps w/ the same or similar features (times x apps!); which do I really want and what are THEIR settings, why TF can't I remove what I don't want, or at least not need seeing it, etc ad infinitum.

7) The push for us to get new versions every year, adding to the massive mountain of electronic waste that no one needs.

8) The whole tracking & surveillance deal, as well as data collecting. What I do is my private business, period.

9) The difficulty in decent ad blocking on smartphones.

10) What the extraction of materials (such as, but not limited to, precious metals & minerals) for manufacturing the phones does to our environment and nature.

11) The working conditions of above workers, including factory/assembly workers.

12) Am enough addicted to the internet as it is. I mean, just look around you and see how many ppl meet your eyes when out and about. Everyone's on their damn phones. I bet it's damaging ppl's interpersonal skills and so much more, too. There's a ton of research on the topic -- and it's not positive.

"Progress"? For sure not in my view. And I try my best not to participate, or get sucked into practices, that don't align w/ my values.

[irrelevant]

I know. But that's BS IMHO. Senior citizens use iPhones & Co. exactly like us younger peepz. The big displays are even beneficial, so there are plenty of touchscreen phones especially for the elderly (or generally people with impaired vision).

Many do, yes. But pretty much no one younger uses a dumbphone; only older do. Except for me, I guess.

[kerospam]

"Progress"? For sure not in my view. And I try my best not to participate, or get sucked into practices, that don't align w/ my values.

"Progress" was refering to the network technology. No one is forcing you into getting a smartphone, I assume everyone can very well understand your reasoning against it.
It's simply the way of life, that old services can not be kept running indefinetly, when the number of users are shrinking. Its not only phone network, you also can't send telegramms anymore, can't find a place to feed your horse, can rarely get 1:25 fuel for your two-stroke engine, analog radio is also deprecated and so on.

[Keks111]

5) Having to update them periodically, like a computer, eventually having them rendered obsolete so that you are forced to get a new one even if your current specimen otherwise is fine.
6) Smartphones overall are so brimming full of shite, I seriously would risk a psychosis. What's in there, what do I want to keep, where (in which order and so on), what are the settings of everything and their mother, ooh -- there are 20 other apps w/ the same or similar features (times x apps!); which do I really want and what are THEIR settings, why TF can't I remove what I don't want, or at least not need seeing it, etc ad infinitum.
7) The push for us to get new versions every year, adding to the massive mountain of electronic waste that no one needs.
8) The whole tracking & surveillance deal, as well as data collecting. What I do is my private business, period.

At least for these points there is a solution: Buy a (used) Google Pixel and install GrapheneOS on it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GrapheneOS
https://grapheneos.org/faq#device-lifetime

9) The difficulty in decent ad blocking on smartphones.

ublock browser extenstion + "adblock.dns.mullvad.net" as private DNS solves this, too.

MMS already dead since a long time as, besides a few exceptions, nobody used ist.
4G/LTE as the successor of 3G started (I think) 15 years go.

[Raetselspass]

I know. But that's BS IMHO. Senior citizens use iPhones & Co. exactly like us younger peepz. The big displays are even beneficial, so there are plenty of touchscreen phones especially for the elderly (or generally people with impaired vision).

Many do, yes. But pretty much no one younger uses a dumbphone; only older do. Except for me, I guess.

Nah, a couple of my friends also use dumbphones. (In fact I know more younger people with dumbphones, than old ones.) But since we are living in Germany, MMS was never a consideration. Just SMS or voice call.

I precisely used the word "progress" because it's neutral and doesn't necessarily mean "improvement". I totally understand your reasoning agaikst smartphones, but as others mentioned as well, this is the way it will be. For me personally, I find 1000s of useful stuff to do with a smartphone besides social media. I really use it as a tool, privately and professionally.

As for the pollution of horse carriages: they are actually worse than cars. And horses need food as well. They just were never that abundant. Having to replace phines seems annoying and wasteful, but there's actually still a lot of improvement happening amd older phones just cannot keep up with the demand.

[irrelevant]

Nah, a couple of my friends also use dumbphones. (In fact I know more younger people with dumbphones, than old ones.) But since we are living in Germany, MMS was never a consideration. Just SMS or voice call.

I precisely used the word "progress" because it's neutral and doesn't necessarily mean "improvement". I totally understand your reasoning agaikst smartphones, but as others mentioned as well, this is the way it will be. For me personally, I find 1000s of useful stuff to do with a smartphone besides social media. I really use it as a tool, privately and professionally.

As for the pollution of horse carriages: they are actually worse than cars. And horses need food as well. They just were never that abundant. Having to replace phines seems annoying and wasteful, but there's actually still a lot of improvement happening amd older phones just cannot keep up with the demand.

Interesting. I did read not too long ago, when 1st looking into this, that more ppl these days actually are looking away from smartphones, and therefore a few "modern" options (not as in functions, but as in newer brands, so to speak). None of them just fit my need w/ voice messaging in one form or other.

However:
"Progress generally means forward or onward movement toward a destination or goal. It refers to the process of gradually improving, advancing, or developing toward a more complete, advanced, or desirable state."

Source: Collins Dictionary

Aside that, I simply raise hackles faced w/ forced much anything -- all the more when so much is at stake. And for those who want on this digitial coercion train, by all means, they can knock themselves out. But IMO we who don't want, or are able, to do so, should have viable alternatives.

You've got to be kidding me thugh. It will be near impossible to convince me horseshit (fertilizer, at that) is worse for life or the environment, than cars.

As for "improvement" & "demand", I'd say most of it is connected to a large portion of ppl's mentality, and what they value. It's likely clear I stepped off that train some near 20 yrs ago.